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Simon: [00:00:00] Good afternoon and welcome to the conference room. I’m joined today by Caleigh Bell. Caleigh is the founder and CEO of All Things Podcasting, a podcast agency that provides business owners a one-stop-shop for all of their podcasting needs. Caleigh’s team handle all aspects of podcasting, launches, monetization, production, management, promotion, guest management, pitching you to be a guest, and they’ll even repurpose your podcast into YouTube videos, blog posts, emails, and even more social contents than you could possibly imagine.

They do all of the work. And strategizing for their clients so their clients can focus on creating amazing content for their audience and leave Caleigh and her team to worry about the rest. Before this, Caleigh had a career in social media management and early childhood education, and I’m delighted that she’s found time in her incredibly busy schedule to talk to [00:01:00] us here on the conference room podcast.

So Caleigh Bell, good afternoon and welcome to the conference room.

Caleigh: Thank you. I think that’s the most excited introduction had done for me on my podcast. So thank you for the warm welcome .

Simon: There we go. Every hero has an origin story and you are the hero of our story. So, Caleigh, tell me how did you get from a career in early childhood education to being the CEO of your own podcasting agency?

Caleigh: Yeah, it’s kind of, a story that I think a lot of working moms have. I was working nine to five, eight to, you know, six constantly working, and my daughter had her I think it was her sixth or her seventh birthday, and I came home from work late and had missed dinner and she was like, I really just wish you were here for my birthday dinner.

I’m sad I didn’t get to see you on my birthday. And then I was like putting her and her little sister to bed and at the time, her little sister required for me to sit with her until she fell asleep. So I was scrolling through my phone and an ad [00:02:00] popped up on how to become a virtual assistant and a social media manager.

And so I was like, That’s it. That’s what I’m gonna do. I’m diving into it and. Three months later, two months later, I had quit my job. So it was very fast, but, and my husband was great and supported me through the whole thing. But yeah, I just wanted more flexibility. I didn’t want to feel like I was selling my soul, you know, and not being the person that I wanted to be, just because I was so focused on my nine to five job and kind of living that life and making those people happy and not focusing on my family.

Simon: Good for you. So, fast forward now, how did you get from being a virtual assistant to starting your own agency?

Caleigh: Yeah, so I did like the virtual assisting, social media management, and I was always kind of doing podcast type work while I was doing that, cause a lot of my clients had podcasts and I really got into the podcasting space as I was learning these skills because there’s so many great podcasts about starting your own business and things like that.

I kind of was pivoting every [00:03:00] couple of months trying to figure out what exactly I wanted to do. offering my clients different services to say, Hey, I wanna try this out. You can try it at a discounted rate. And so I did. Facebook and Instagram ads for a while. I did social media management. I was doing like very beginner level podcast management stuff.

and then I kind of like took a step back and looked at like my business and what I enjoyed doing and what I saw the biggest impact from. And I kind of realized I had never purchased anything from anybody online without first binging their podcast. And so I was like, that’s really impactful way that people can create connections with their audience and convince people to purchase from them even if they’re not selling, because you’re just building that relationship.

And so it leaves you like wanting more from that person. So that’s kind of when I went all in on podcasting. And then I very quickly realized that editing takes a long, long time and I did not want to be doing all of that myself. So my best friend had actually joined in on the virtual assisting business.

With me, like she was doing her own thing and [00:04:00] I was doing my own thing. We were kind of like helping each other grow. And I was like, Hey, do you wanna come and be all in with me and do this podcast agency? So it’s still just me and her. She kind of does like the backend tech stuff. And then I do more of the forward facing, growing the business, getting clients, running our mastermind, things like that.

Simon: Great stuff. Fantastic. So when you are engaging with your clients, okay, what are the problems that you see most commonly you’ve been brought in to solve?

Caleigh: Yeah, so like, the number one thing I hear is that they have been on Facebook, they’ve been on Instagram, they’ve tried doing TikTok, they’ve tried Pinterest.

They’ve kind of had their toes dipped in all of these different ponds trying to find where their audience is, trying to build connections with people. And either A, they’re not consistent with it because they don’t see like immediate results. So they just give up or they’re like trying to be consistent with it, and they’re just not seeing those returns.

They’re not building their audience. Just feel like they’re trying everything and nothing’s working, so they’re frustrated. And so we kind of like. Come in [00:05:00] and like analyze that for them. And we’re like, Okay, so here’s the deal. Like we can take like one piece of content. And also another thing is that they have hired social media managers and things before, and I have always felt like it wasn’t coming across as their voice.

It wasn’t authentic to them when the content was going out. It didn’t sound like them. It wasn’t the wording that they would have used. So we kind of explain it to him this way. Like, you’re gonna say it one time and then we’re going to echo it across the internet for you. So like you’re gonna say it once and that’s gonna be like your podcast in your YouTube episode.

And then we’re gonna take it and turn it into all these different things. So you can show up on all of these platforms that you know that your audience is, but you can’t be consistent everywhere. That’s why everybody always says like, only do one platform at a time. Like go all in on Facebook or all in on Instagram because you’ll burn out if you try to show up in all the places you know all at one time.

But with a repurposing strategy and having somebody else do it for you, especially, you’re able to take that one piece of content and turn it into content for all of the places. [00:06:00] So you’re able to show up everywhere and meet your audience everywhere that they are without having to create new content for each platform every week.

Simon: Right, Absolutely. So for the people that haven’t necessarily decided to start a podcast yet, what do you see as the primary advantages for a business, to actually start one?

Caleigh: So the biggest thing, is the connections that you build. So like not only are you putting this content out here so that your audience can build better connections with you, but one of the unexpected things that I didn’t even think about when I first started doing this is the connections that you build with guests that you have on.

And then their connections that they bring into your circle, or you being a guest on somebody else’s podcast, you end up creating all of these really cool connections with people in similar spaces as you, which helps you propel your business. It’s almost like having a group of affiliates backing you up without the official affiliate title.

Like, these are your cheerleaders. They’re coming to you. Like they’re saying, I did a really great podcast episode with this person. I know them. I like them, I trust them. And so they’re gonna kind of be [00:07:00] your cheerleaders and refer you to people. But on top of that, like your audience that you already have is going to be coming to the podcast and become even more invested in you and your content and really get to know and like you and trust you.

So that makes them more likely to buy. And then also the same way we talk about like, Pinterest isn’t social media, it’s a search platform. Podcasting’s the same way. It’s very SEO driven. And so when people go to a podcast or they go to Pinterest or they go to Google, those are places where people are going to look for a solution to a problem.

So they’re gonna go in and they’re gonna search how to grow my business in 90 days, or they’re gonna search business growth tips, things like that. And if your podcast is the first one to come up, they’re gonna find you. They’re gonna listen to that episode, probably listen to more episodes and become part of your funnel.

Simon: Absolutely. I’ll tell you what’s interesting as well is, I think it would be, a bit silly not to acknowledge the fact that you are talking on a podcast right now.

Caleigh: Yeah.

Simon: I’m a podcast host, right? So, this is an area that I have, you know, a little bit of knowledge. I think what I found, most [00:08:00] interesting when we started the podcast was not only the fact that, it was an opportunity to get my message out and raise mine and, the businesses profiles, Salisis profile.

But also the fact that it elevated me and the business, in the eyes of the people that were guests and, as well as having potential, as you say, affiliates and cheerleaders and their audience coming in and, if you’re like borrowing credibility from one another, the other thing as well was it meant that, I could reach out to, potential clients that otherwise, you know, how do I get heard above the chatter, right?

But I could go to a potential client and rather than it be, Hi, I’m Simon, a head hunter from Salisi. Hi, I’m Simon, a podcast host. I’d like to talk to you about being on my podcast, so it really, elevates the initial discussion and really is a way, you know, to set me at part. You talked about monetization.

What are the primary, challenges that you see your clients facing when it comes to monetizing their podcast?

Caleigh: Number one thing is that they think that the only way to monetize their podcast is to get sponsors and run ads [00:09:00] on their podcast. And like most of our audience is, Course creators. They have memberships, they have online programs, they have digital products.

They have something that they’re selling online, so the biggest thing that like we have to get them to do is sell themselves on the podcast first. That’s always our first focus when we launch, this podcast is about you. It’s about your business. You’re trying to get new clients, sell your online course, whatever.

And so that’s a big thing is like teaching them how to sell on the podcast without being like super salesy and gross and making people feel like you’re just putting the podcast out to, you know, make a sale. So we kind of do like multiple call to actions throughout the podcast. Some are to a freebie, some are to a paid offer that’s a smaller offer.

Some are to a larger paid offer, some are to join a Facebook group. So we’re giving people different call to actions to kind of go from the podcast into your more main funnel. And then also I think people, aren’t willing to stick with it long enough to see the return. So like people will have a podcast, say [00:10:00] they do one, three month season or something, and they’re like, Well, I only made one sale.

I’m like, It’s, a longer game. It’s a marathon. It’s not a sprint. So you kind of have to wait things out, let those people get to know you, let them build that trust. The people who are coming to your podcast are typically the people who have to think about things a little bit longer before they make a decision.

So you kind of have to go through that process with them. Yeah, and I think that’s like that, and like not knowing how to charge for sponsorships and things like that, and not knowing how to do affiliates and all of that craziness, those are probably the big monetization things that I see people struggle with.

Simon: Right. Yeah, absolutely. And, when I talk to other podcasters, and a lot of people come onto my podcast, have their own and, and often, I get invited to be on other people’s podcasts. A lot of times the challenge they have is they never thought that part through, when they launched.

It was like, I wanna launch, I wanna build an audience, and then I’ll think about monetizing. And I think the, advantage that we had was that we had our monetization strategy really kind of nailed down, really dialed in. Before we started it was like, The whole [00:11:00] reason why we are launching the podcast is to achieve these specific goals, as opposed to let’s launch a podcast and then figure out, now we’ve launched it, how we’re gonna monetize.

Because I would imagine that if your monetization strategy has to be supported by the way you deliver your content. And if you only think about that after the fact, suddenly it’s gonna be quite a dramatic shift. If, for example, you think 10 episodes in, Oh, I’ve built this audience now, and I have to start running ads, or I have to start running sponsorships.

Episode 11, if every 20 minutes or 10 minutes your going, We’re now gonna take a break, we’re now sponsored by, fill in the blank. That might start to alienate or jar with the audience that’s used to it having a certain style and flare and so on. Is that something that you’ve seen, affect your client base?

Caleigh: Yeah. Definitely. So most of our one-on-one clients, we’ve launched their podcast from the very beginning, so we’ve kind of had that strategy ready to go. Like we’ve talked about, you know, how we’re going to monetize if they wanna have sponsors.

And we have like successfully gone with our clients and gone, season [00:12:00] one, we don’t have any sponsors and season two, we do have sponsors. And I think the most important thing is to not feel like sleazy and gross about it. You kind of have to tell your audience what’s coming. Hey, you know, we’re bringing this podcast to you for free. We wanna keep delivering free content and value to you all each week.

In order to help support the podcast, we’re gonna be running ads. All of these ads are gonna be for things that we personally use and support. And that also helps the conversions on those ads. If people know these aren’t just random ads that we’re putting in here, these are things that we actually recommend. And then also like, we like to do our ads where it’s the host.

Speaking the ad out and doing the ad role because it kind of keeps that familiarity going throughout it. And there’s a lot of different thought theories on that, and there’s no like right or wrong way, but that’s kind of what we’ve seen, especially for like the audiences that our clients have. They like to hear that person’s voice.

It’s almost like they’re best friends. So they like that continuation of the host speaking and of course it’s prerecorded and we just [00:13:00] plug it in there, but the audience doesn’t really realize that. and making sure that those ads arent, you know, five minutes long in the middle of the episode and ruin everybody’s flow of life.

Those are some of the like, important things that we’ve kind of gone through with our clients and kind of explained to them how they can keep being authentic, keep showing up in a feel good way for their audience, but also get those sponsorships in and make some money while they’re doing what they love to do.

Simon: Right. On that note, we’ll be right back. no, im kidding. So, yeah, We don’t run out here again. It was never part of our strategy. You know, we monetize in a very different way. And again, you know, one size doesn’t fit all. There are a number of monetization strategies and I think you’re right.

It’s really important that people, you know, bear that in mind before moving forward with, you know, with what they’re doing. It has to be kind of like. Baked into the dna of what they’re trying to do. So, What would you say are the primary differences between, a B2B style podcast? Or something that’s like, a podcast that’s literally about business, right.

Versus a podcast that’s more consumer [00:14:00] driven. Okay. We’re gonna do a podcast about. I’m an aquarium as it happens. I keep marine and coral fish. Okay. I could have done a podcast about that. I’m an avid, single malt whiskey collector. I did briefly consider doing a podcast about that.

What would you say the difference is in the strategy between somebody that wants to do a podcast about business and directed at business people versus one that’s more kind of consumer driven?

Caleigh: So there’s a ton of differences and there’s a wide range on those things. There’s, you know, the b2b, like I’m a business talking to other business owners about how to market their business, right?

And then there’s the people who have a business, but it’s B to C, it’s business to customer. So they’re talking directly to a customer, be it a health coach or somebody teaching, I don’t know how to get your baby to nap for two hours a day, or whatever.

Simon: Anytime, anytime. My god.

Sorry, a little bit of delayed PTSD there.

So sorry.

Caleigh: So yeah, so there’s the b2b, there’s the B to C, and [00:15:00] then there’s like, I call ’em hobby podcast. And that, I don’t mean that in an insulting way at all, but it’s something that you’re doing because you want to put it out there and you want to do the, like, create the content. And it’s not necessarily in order to grow a business or create.

Huge sustainable income. And of course there’s like things in between. Like there are people who have podcasts that are about their passions that do have sponsors and do make money from them. There’s just such a wide range there. And I think that the biggest thing going into it is you have to decide when you’re launching and when you’re creating the content, like what is the purpose of this podcast?

Who is my audience? Why do I want them to listen? Why should they want to listen? What action do I want them to take? And you kind of have to like figure out before you’re launching if you’re going to do this to try to make money. And if so, how? Just like you were saying, that’s like the main core difference especially when it comes to people who are launching their podcast.

Because, I feel like a lot of people go into it, just like people watching a YouTube [00:16:00] channel. They go into it and they’re like, I’m gonna be rich. I’m like, yeah that’s not really how it works. Like you have to have something to drive these people to in order to make money. You’re not typically, unless you have some really good sponsor hookups when you’re first starting your podcast, you’re not gonna be rich.

You’re not gonna make a lot of money simply from having a podcast that exists out in the world. So it’s different strategies, different setups, different methods to kind of set the podcast up in a way that makes sense for you. And also your expectations, like business podcasts get way more downloads than a podcast about an aquarium, so you can’t expect the downloads to be the same as, you know, Gary B or Amy Porterfield or any of those people

Simon: Right? No, absolutely. Okay. We’ll talk about the launch process in just a moment, but another key element, in having a sustainable and growing podcast is, of course audience growth. Okay. What would you say are the biggest mistakes that you either see your clients make or you definitely help them avoid? And what are the key [00:17:00] strategies that, you think are really essential for audience growth?

Caleigh: So, number one is being consistent. If you are doing a podcast and you’re doing it weekly, you have to show up weekly. If you’re doing it biweekly, you have to show up biweekly. If you are taking a break, cool, we totally love taking a break from your podcast.

Totally fine. Take a break over Christmas. But you have to let your audience know. They don’t wanna see you like drop off the face of the earth. That’s when you start losing your audience. So that’s like number one is maintaining the audience that you already have. Same thing goes for your content. You have to provide consistent value with each episode.

Otherwise it’s like when you’re watching a show and you’re three episodes in, you’re like, Oh, this is really good. And episode number four is boring and puts you to sleep. Like, are you gonna go back and watch episode five? Probably not. So you have to keep that consistency with the level of the content as well.

And then also like I just was talking to somebody today who was talking about growing their podcast and like wanted more information on our services and all of that, and I was like, Okay, [00:18:00] first of all, I just went to your website, your Facebook page for your business and your personal Facebook page and could not find your podcast anywhere.

So like you’re not sharing it on other places, like in letting your existing audience know that the podcast exists and putting it out. Like if somebody stumbles across you on Instagram, they may not follow you on Instagram, but they may go and listen to your podcast. So like making those things available for people and letting people know that you have the podcast.

Those are like the two biggest things that are like quick and easy that I see people skipping over. They’re not sharing about their podcast anywhere, so people aren’t converting from their Facebook and Instagram, LinkedIn, wherever audiences to the podcast, which is then kind of cutting them out of that.

You know, that bottom triangle of your funnel because your podcast is where a lot of those conversions happen,

Simon: Right. Absolutely. And where do you, sit on, on guessing on other people’s podcasts? I mean, when we did your bio, part of the, the introduction was you help people be guests on other people’s podcasts.

Do you feel that that [00:19:00] is, a way to enhance and borrow another audience and kind of bring them in? Or is it more well that kind of come in and listen to that, they’ll hear you on the other person’s show, but they won’t necessarily follow you, from that show to yours.

Caleigh: Yeah, I think that we’ve seen our clients have a lot of growth from guesting on other podcasts.

And actually a lot of our clients, we like flip flop months with them. Like one month we’re pitching them to be a guest, and the next month we’re pitching people to be their guest. So we kind of like flip flop back and forth and it helps. Kind of keep things consistent and keeps that growth, you know, on a steady incline.

There’s a lot of things to keep in mind when it comes to what podcast you’re pitching. You want them to have a similar audience, but you don’t want them to be in direct competition with you. Kind of like the same deal as when you are asking people to be a guest on your podcast. But we definitely see big growth happen, especially if you’re on a bigger name podcast.

And if the podcast host you see that they don’t do a lot of social media promotion on their end, we like to create graphics on our end for their [00:20:00] podcast episode and send them to them. Like, Here’s some graphics we made for your podcast episode. You should share these wink wink so that we can get the word out to their social channels as well.

Simon: Right, Absolutely. And I suppose that might be a way for you to get more clients for yourself if you’re seeing them guessing on other podcasts that aren’t really.

Caleigh: Yeah.

Simon: Absolutely. Okay, so let’s talk about launching. Okay. Somebody wakes up on a bright Thursday morning and says, do you know what? I’ve decided the world is itching to hear my voice.

I have, passion about single malt whiskey, or I wanna, create a podcast about business growth, or I wanna create a podcast about podcasting. Okay. Whatever it is, the world has waited long enough to hear what I have to say, right? Assuming that they’ve got the monetization strategy right, they’ve figured out how often they’re gonna podcast and all the kind of, strategies has been mapped out.

What’s next? And I guess the reason why I’m asking is thinking. Caleigh, what on earth did I do wrong?

Caleigh: Yeah. So it is a journey to launch a podcast. There are a number of things that can go right and a [00:21:00] number of things that can go wrong. But really, the next thing is mapping out your intro, your outro and your trailer.

There’s a ton of strategy that goes into those. Your intro, you really have to grab people’s attention in the first, like 10 to 15 seconds because people have short attention spans. They’re gonna hop off if they’re not feeling drawn into what you’re saying in the first couple of seconds of that intro.

And then your outro. We always wanna put a call to action in the outro. And then the trailer is, You have to have a trailer in order to launch. You can either have a trailer, you can have episode one go live before your actual launch date, because you have to have an episode like kind of in the bank and ready before you can submit your podcast to all of the podcasting places, which I’m sure you experience through your process.

So the trailer we have kind of like set up as a, here’s what the podcast is going to bring to you. Here’s a little about me. Here’s the benefits of listening to the podcast. Here’s some things that we’re gonna be talking about. It’s basically like an expanded upon description of the podcast.

It’s gonna tell [00:22:00] people if the podcast is going to be a right fit for them, why they should listen, why they should care, all that good stuff. So then, Once those pieces are put together, you have your intro and your outro mixed with music. You’ve got your trailer ready to go, you upload those to your hosting platform.

We like to use Lipson. Buzz Sprout has gained some popularity and has worked out a lot of their issues, so that’s been a good one lately. There’s a thousand different podcast hosting platforms out there. And once you upload that episode to the podcast hosting platform, it’s gonna give you what’s called an RSS feed, which is basically just the link in which your podcast lives.

Its little podcast home, and you take that link and submit it to all of the places. Apple, Spotify, iHeartRadio all of the good podcast platforms. And then your episode is kind of live. Oh. And cover art. You have to have cover art, of course. Which I could do a whole episode on Cover Art alone.

So you have these pieces, you put ’em into your podcasting host, and then it kind of distributes that content across the board to all of the [00:23:00] podcasting platforms. And then each week when you go to release a new episode, you just go back to that podcasting host and upload a new episode. We recommend launching with three episodes, kind of, it’s like a Netflix strategy.

Like people are gonna come in and they are gonna wanna listen to multiple episodes back to back because the podcast is new, It’s exciting. They’re, you know, really into it. So we give them three episodes to kind of binge, and then after that we upload a weekly or biweekly episode.

Simon: It’s really interesting.

It’s about launching with three, because, Okay. I’m a huge Handmaid’s tale fan. Okay. There. I’ve said it. Okay. And at the point where you and I are recording this, I think there’s maybe like two or three episodes that have gone live of season, or five I think it is. and, I’m waiting until they’re all there because I know I’m just gonna binge the entire season in the space of like two days.

It’s gonna be a grueling weekend, but I’m ready for it. Right. So, and similarly, if I stumble upon a podcast, that’s about a subject I’m interested in, if there’s fewer then,[00:24:00] probably six or seven episodes , and current episodes i’ll probably, put a pin in it and come back to it if I remember to do so.

So having a bank of a number of ones that I can binge and consume at the same time, for me is a big deal. Similarly, If a podcast hasn’t done anything for the last few months, it’ll be like, Why would I fall in love with this if I know It’s just never gonna continue. Right? It’s like watching season one of firefly.

You know? Like, why would you put yourself through that? So, yeah, it’s interesting talking about the, you know, these things and when we launched, we launched with the trailer in episode one and then episode two and episode three, and it was only when we got to, I think, probably the two spikes that we saw that really propelled our audience.

And then we started to see, you know, a, geometric progression, to really propel us into. Kind of three, then four, and now five figures, of listeners. Was I think episode 10 and then about episode 25 30 around there. When we saw the big spikes in audience share.

And then we grow pretty much every week. You know, [00:25:00] some will grow, you know, more than others, but for the most part, we’re seeing more of an arithmetic progression. When we got to through episode 10, under episode 25, 30. Is that what typically you see from your, I mean, not necessarily those same numbers, but is that typically what you are seeing?

Is that normal?

Caleigh: Yeah, so with having like the first three episodes, you kind of are able to like, grab people’s attention. So like, if they are, into episodes where you have guests, like if you’re gonna have guests on the podcast and do solo episodes, you’re going to have a guest episode in there.

So you’re giving them a sampling in those first three episodes. And then like as you carry on and follow that same like pattern, we see like once you have like four or five guest episodes, then we see an uptick. Once you have like, five or six solo episodes, then we see an uptick and it’s like kind of steady until you get to like episode 10 and then you’ll see a steep incline, then it kind of levels out and you get to like episode, it’s somewhere between 20 and 50, depending on where the podcast is.

Simon: Right, So around 25 to 30, somewhere around that.

Caleigh: Yeah.

Simon: Yeah.

Caleigh: And then you’ll see another kind [00:26:00] of uptick. And the biggest thing you wanna like keep in mind is that it’s steady and you want it to be somewhat consistent because a lot of people. Advertise like, we’re gonna get you to the top 1% in, you know, on your launch and all of this.

And what they’re doing is they’re buying listeners and so they are paying people. You know, all over the world to listen to your podcast episode on the day it launches, which then throws your podcast stats off and sends you to the top 1% for that short period of time right as you’re launching, which is great for like social media hype, but those people weren’t your audience.

So when you’re working with somebody that’s like, kind of my warning tale is when you’re working with somebody, make sure your growth is consistent and that it’s always going up. And, you know, you’ll have little down spurts here and there. You know, you’ll have an episode with a famous guest and it’ll go up and, some of those people won’t listen again.

But if you’re seeing like a huge peak and then it drops off and you’re back down to where you were before, then that strategy isn’t really working for you. It’s not really bringing [00:27:00] your people in.

Simon: Right? Absolutely. It’s interesting because what we found once we kind of really hit our stride, Was that we would bring in a guest that had quite a, you know, particularly guests that were operating all the social medias.

So they had a social media following. We would bring them in, we would maintain our own audience, we kind of borrow some of theirs who might stay with us for another episode or two, but then they would kind of fall away. But didn’t really matter too much because the guests that we had the subsequent weeks would bring in their audience.

So it was almost like we had our own core audience. There was like a revolving door of guest borrowed audience. Right. But because a small percentage of them would stay anyway, then it didn’t really matter that we still had that kind of revolving door. It was almost like a spiral was kind of going upwards where every week we might borrow, say a hundred guests , like, this week you might be bringing a hundred of your audience to this podcast.

98 of them might leave, but that’s fine cause at least we’ve got two of them to stay. And then the following week, another guest will bring a hundred of theirs, 98 might [00:28:00] leave, but we’ve kept another two. And that was really the kind of organic growth that we were finding. Does that resonate with what you find your own customers were having?

Caleigh: Yeah, definitely. And that’s, you know, the way that we want that sustainable growth, you know, you’re, even though you’re seeing a big uptick and it’s this particular audience for this week or two, and then it’s, those people are leaving, you’re still growing by two, five listeners every week. And so that’s what we wanna see.

We wanna see that incremental growth, you’re just taking one step. Each and every week to growing the podcast.

Simon: Right. And because you’re active on social media as well, you never know that that one guest might bring in, you know, four or five, audience members. One or two might become a major champions and are sharing, Oh, had this great thing on Caleigh’s podcast and it was amazing and, you know, you should listen to it.

And then they’re sharing it and they’re, you know, so you just don’t know. And I know that we have some champions that the listeners, I dunno who they are. But thank you. I’m sure you are listening. Thank you [00:29:00] very much. And you know, there are, there, you know, pushing things on, social media, which has, which has fueled, you know, the listenership that we have and, you know, they’re not all my mum, you know, so, we’re proudly, and we have been for gosh, over a year now, I think maybe 18 months or so, we’ve been in the top 1% of global podcasts.

You know, it’s really humbling that we’ve managed to achieve that. You know, it’s an extraordinary thing and it’s not paid. It’s not.

Caleigh: Right.

Simon: You know, it’s, they’re real listeners and hello to all of you. Yeah, we’re very grateful to have you here. So what would you say are your top three tips for someone to be a successful podcaster?

Caleigh: That’s a loaded question. Okay. So to be successful in podcasting, I would say, Step number one is just do it. Like I can’t tell you how many of our clients have reached out to us and been like, I’ve had a mic in my closet for three years and I’ve been talking about starting my podcast and I haven’t done it.

And I’m like, Why not? Well, I couldn’t afford to hire a bunch of people and I couldn’t do this and I didn’t have this. And like just [00:30:00] start, like if you go back like I’m gonna use Joe Rogan as an example. Joe Rogan’s first hundred episodes are terrible. They’re the worst. And if you listen to his podcast now, it’s all professionally produced, very like done up the audio quality’s great.

All of that. So like don’t stress about. And that kind of leads into step number two, but don’t stress about like getting everything perfect when you’re first starting out. Like just putting the content out there for people. Is going to be better than not doing anything, than always having it in your back of your mind.

Like, I should really launch a podcast. Like even if the same 10 people that like all your stuff on social media are the only ones listening, like that’s better than nothing. And if you kind of dive into it, then you’re gonna get more confident and. Things are going to start happening for you and all of that good stuff.

So start before you’re ready. Step number two is done is better than perfect. Like we just started with , one of our clients, and he like is very critical of himself and he’s like, I don’t like the way that sounds. I don’t like this. Can you change what I said here? And like, I’m like, It’s [00:31:00] okay. Like it doesn’t have to be perfect.

You are the only one in the world that is picking up all of those things that you want changed. Nobody else is seeing it. Nobody else cares that much. Like you’re being so hyper critical on yourself and like stressing about it, and you just don’t need to, don’t stress about it being perfect. It’s never going to be perfect.

Done is better than perfect. And then number three would be to show up as the person that you wanna be a year from now. So when you start recording those first podcast episodes, Don’t do it. As Caleigh who just launched her podcast, and this is my first episode, and God, I’m so nervous, show up as Caleigh who’s been podcasting for a year and has 10,000 subscribers and a huge thriving business and is being asked to do speaking events and like show up as that version of you because people feel that when you’re talking on the mic.

So just like before you start recording kind of channel future confident you and dive in and do it, and don’t go back and re-listen to your episode because you’re gonna find [00:32:00] 5,000 things wrong and just put it out into the world. Send it to your editor if you have one and let them make it beautiful.

But yeah, that’s really like the top three things that are like totally non-tech, non strategy, like total mindset things around launching a podcast that I think are the biggest hurdles before people get started.

Simon: That’s fantastic. It really is. And luckily, I think that, kind of thinking back to, the sort of but about two years ago, the fall of 2020 when we were just kinda like starting to put this thing together.

That’s without obviously having heard that advice, that’s pretty much what we did. I mean if you wanna put yourself through the pain of listening to the first few episodes of this podcast, you’re welcome to do so. But you can sort of see we get better in retina.

And I was very, very lucky that the guests that we had in those first half a dozen episodes really carried me. I mean, they really, they were fantastic. No disrespect to you cause you are amazing too, but , the ones back there had to do a lot more heavy lifting. And, they made me look good, let’s put it that way.

And you are write absolutely about, you know, perfection being the enemy of progress. I mean if I had my way, I’d [00:33:00] still be editing episode one right now. It wouldn’t have gone out there. And, it really did. The fact that I’ve kind of announced to the world I’m gonna get a podcast out before the end of the year, meant that I had to do it, I had to deliver on it.

So, yeah and you’re right. I mean, just showing up, and actually doing it sets you apart , from so many other people. And I can’t remember the actual, number, but someone told me that, something like 85% of podcasts, sorry, 85% of podcast series, whatever you wanna call them, are dead a defunct, you know, people either.

Did one or two and then just stopped. Right? And once you get started, first of all, there are probably a gazillion podcasts that never saw the light of day cause people never actually did them. Right. And so, assuming you just record the trailer, in episode one that sets you, apart from the billions of other people have never even bothered.

Right? And then once you kind of get past episode five, you’ve beaten a whole bunch of people. Episode 10, you’ve beat a whole bunch of other people and so on and so forth. Right? I think this is gonna be in, I’m not sure exactly what episode you and I are recording right now. It’s gonna be in the seventies.

[00:34:00] And, you know, we’re not that far away from hitting episode hundred. So, you know, and how many people have done that? So, you know, and I guess, you know, you probably won’t be kind enough to say it, but sorry. Wouldn’t be unkind enough to say it but I will, if I can do it, anyone can.

Caleigh: Yeah. It’s kind of like, it always reminds me of like the.

You’re running like start running and you’re running really slow and you’re like, Oh, I’m not a marathon runner, all of this. But then like my husband always tells me, You’re lapping everybody who’s at home on the couch right now, if just getting out there and doing it like you are taking that action, you.

Like, don’t compare yourself to people who are 20 steps ahead of you, because you’re gonna be there one day. But compare yourself to like all the people who have been too scared to do it, and the version of you that was too scared to do it. And like, ask yourself like, which version do I wanna be? And just take that first step and do it.

And don’t be worried about like, Oh, well the first episode went and only 10 people listened. And , I’m just not gonna do it now. Like, you know how many Facebook Lives I’ve done? And literally nobody watched. [00:35:00] Like, it’s fine. Like you’re putting it out there, you’re putting yourself out there. It’s okay.

Eventually somebody’s gonna come back and watch it and be like, This is the best thing. This is exactly what I needed to hear, Which happens all the time. So put it out there, leave it up, let people come and find it. And don’t worry about the haters.

Simon: Absolutely. And, Go back to an earlier episode of this podcast, and, we have some very, very good ones on, mindset, particularly on doing Facebook Lives when nobody showed up.

We’ve got, Forgive me, I forget exactly which, which episode it was, but we have a fantastic podcast. That specifically talks about that, that people can refer to. But yeah, I completely agree. And, you know, we could talk for hours on this, but what’s next for you and for the business?

Caleigh: Thanks. So we have had many versions of a DIY year podcast kind of program for people because we completely understand not everybody can afford to hire a full team to run their podcast for them. So we had a DIY course and then we did a mastermind on like, how to repurpose all of your content. And then we realized we had a lot of people in, [00:36:00] or in a membership rather.

We had a lot of people in the membership who had never launched their podcast. So I’m like, Well, hold up a minute. You have to launch before you can repurpose, so let’s go back to square one. So we’ve kind of taken everything, put it together into a high touch mastermind for people, to learn how to launch their podcast quickly, effectively, in the right way, with the right strategies.

We’re literally giving like all of our scripts, all of that good juicy stuff away. Very high touched like were, auditing everything as we’re going, making sure that it’s done correctly. And so we just launched our first cohort, so that’s kind of what’s next is growing that into kind of this movement of people getting out there and launching their podcast and showing up and being able to repurpose their content and not be on social media hustling all the time.

So that’s kind of my 2023 mission is to get people into that and watch them launch their beautiful little podcast, Butterflies.

Simon: Great stuff. And how can people find that?

Caleigh: Yeah, so I have a link for [00:37:00] it, which I’ll share with you or you can always find us in, like, our Facebook group is where I share like every time something is opening up, like right now we’re doing a 30 days of content challenge in there.

So we always have fun, crazy stuff going on in there.

Simon: Great stuff, and I’ll make sure the links, are posted in the show notes. Caleigh, if people wanted to reach out to you or to work with you or with the organization, how best can they reach out to either yourself or All things podcasting

Caleigh: Yeah, so you can reach me through dms on Instagram or Facebook.

That is probably the best way to reach me or you can always send me an email at [email protected] Our website is all things podcasting.com. But I’m gonna be totally honest and tell you, it is very out of date right now, , so I would not trust the information you gain on our website,

Simon: Great stuff.

I’ll make sure that we’ve got links to that and, for people to be able to DM you both through Facebook and Instagram, and also to go to your Facebook group. [00:38:00] Caleigh, thank you so much for joining us. I wouldn’t have thought that having been running a top 1% podcast for over 18 months that, I would’ve learned as much as I have today, but oh my goodness, have I learned a lot and it’s been an absolute, absolute joy, spending time with you and, learning about all this stuff.

So, Caleigh Bell, thank you so much for joining us here on the conference room.

Caleigh: Thank you so much for having me. It’s been really fun.

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